Walking for Wellbeing

Mike walks and talks us through the benefits of taking a stroll to improve our mental health. Either listen where you are, or pop your headphones in and take a walk with us!

Transcript

Mike O’Hara 
This is the happy employee podcast. Brought to you by start within. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
Hello and welcome to the happy employee podcast. This episode is all about taking a walk and how it could improve your mental health. Mike and I are big walkers and we've often referenced taken a walk in previous episodes. So today Mike is going to walk and talk us through His evening stroll and discuss how walking can improve sleep mood, as well as reduce stress, anxiety and fatigue. Either listen where you are, or pop your headphones in and take a walk with us. Hi, Mike. Hello. Hello. So you're out walking. I have yet I'm starting my walk. Mm hmm. So you're gonna talk to us a little bit about where you are gonna walk today? And why? 
 
Mike O’Hara 
Yeah, so today, we thought we'd try something a little bit different. And we'd send me out for a walk so that I can tell you firsthand how much better it makes me feel in terms of my mental health, as well as my physical well being, and just talk about some of the benefits of walking on our well being. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
So where are you walking today? 
 
Mike O’Hara 
Well, I've just left the house. And I think it's important to sort of address right away that not all of us will have access to rolling fields of green and lovely woods to walk through or a beach to walk down. It might be a built up area where it's surrounded by houses, like where I am. Right now I'm currently walking through some houses. I mean, it's nice enough, it's a nice evening, but it's not as picturesque as you might hope for a walk. But even with that, it still gives you that time away that time to think time to relax, time to run things through in your mind and wherever it might be. I want the message to be that walking is good for our mental health and well being however we can build it into our daily routine. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
So when did you start walking them? 
 
Mike O’Hara 
I don't know when I was about one. So I stopped crawling is a very odd thing to say I'm actually a bit of a late comer to walking. I've obviously been aware of the mental health benefits of physical exercise for a long time. A lot of us will be familiar with that concept. But I think we always think of that as something sort of high intensity, like we have to go for a run or we have to go out on the bike rather play a game of football. We don't always think that walking, which is something we obviously do every day to get from A to B is something that can be good for both physical and mental health as well. So to answer your original question, probably only about four or five years ago actually, I was a bit of a bit of a sceptic when it came to Kind of walking for leisure if that makes sense. Never been a outdoorsy person. I didn't particularly like the idea of a waterproof jacket and some walking boots on and going up a hill. But the first time I did it, I realised how fulfilling it was, how much actually loved it and how good it made me feel when. So now I'm a real advocate for building a decent walk into my daily routine. quite fortunate to have not just the Greyhound path that kind of forces me to get up and go for a walk first thing in the morning and also after work. But by doing that and building that into my routine, it gives me first that comm start to the day. And then secondly, after I've been at work for the day, it gives me that kind of stress release as well. Yeah. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
So you mentioned that you know, getting your walking boots on and go for a proper ramble. But just so the listeners know what are you wearing today? Not in a seedy way. 
 
Let's rephrase. What do you have on your feet? What equipment do you have on? I don't know. 
 
Mike O’Hara 
So I've got my shorts and flip flops on. So I'm not in any bespoke walking gear. I've literally stuck some flip flops on and walked out the front door. And it's free, obviously, as well. It's not like other sports or activities like that, where you have to get all the gear and pay a fortune. We can all just stick on a pair of trainers, flip flops, wherever it might be, and just go for a walk around the block. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
Yeah. So it's free. It's good for fitness and physical health as well as being good for our mental health because it's clear in the mind. Yeah, in the back in the moment. So I'm thinking back to when I used to have a job that I really hated and I get quite stressed and wound up and I used to find that it really helped me to go out for a walk on my lunch break. Maybe more of a storm sometimes and just yeah, power around the block and But I used to find it really helped me in releasing bits of my anger and calming me down a little bit. 
 
Mike O’Hara 
Yeah. And if we relate it back to the stress bucket that we talked about in Episode Four, I think I'm right in saying, oh three, okay. You Yeah, if we relate it back to that it, it fits into that category of a positive coping strategy. So when we talk about those positive tap turns that release the stress that prevents our stress bucket from overflowing, I would certainly put a nice walk into that category because there's something that we know makes us feel better. The science is obviously there behind it to tell us that it releases endorphins and the physical exercise is good for us and all those good things. But also, we know that it's something that will reduce our stress, and it's not a temporary fix as well. It's not something like pouring ourselves a large gin and tonic or smoking a cigarette or snapping at a loved one which might feel good at the time. It might give us that instant release of stress or anger or whatever that emotion is, but ultimately Add to add on top of it. I mean, those things that I just described there, they're ultimately going to add to our stress and anxiety. I don't think I've ever come back from a walk and felt more stressed than when I left. So that's really true. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
Yeah. So what do you feel about walking meetings? It seems to be a bit of a buzzword in the office. Yeah. 
 
Mike O’Hara 
Yeah. Yeah, sorry for all those for those that haven't heard about walking meetings as a kind of phenomenon. I have seen them being introduced in quite a few of the organisations that I've worked with fairly recently. And it's certainly something that I think will we could all benefit from when we all go back to work from this kind of lockdown situation as well because we will be pretty fed up with the indoors I think I think I can speak for everyone when I say that. Obviously in the UK where we are now it's not always perfect weather rewarding walking, meeting. But essentially the premises that we take those meetings that we'd normally have in the office, probably better off those meetings that only have a few participants as opposed to large kind of board meetings or anything like that. But we take that meeting outside. And we, we walk, sometimes we talk. So we walk and talk essentially, the idea being that when we walk, there's a number of positive benefits on our mind, first of all, so increased blood flow to the brain, which helps us to make better decisions and to think more clearly. There's obviously that release of endorphins that talked about before, which makes us feel good makes us more upbeat and positive and enthusiastic. And also, there's elements of the walking meeting that take the awkwardness out of situations that can feel quite intimidating at times. So if you imagine you're new into your organisation, and you've got a big meeting with your boss for the first time, it's actually Chairman say, let's go for let's go for it. Walk down to the, to the coffee shop or let's go for a walk around the local park. And let's, let's talk about stuff there, then I think it actually removes some of that awkwardness because you've got something else to distract you, if you like. And something else to take away that social anxiety, which is the actual act of walking, often you're heading to somewhere where you've got an end goal, which helps to kind of structure the meeting as well. And also, a really important point is that around silence because if you can imagine when you're in a, in an office setting or something like that, where it might be quite intimidating and quite awkward, silence can be excruciating. Whereas if you're out for a walk, whether it's with someone from work, or whether it's just walking the dog with your spouse or walking with a friend, there will be those periods when there's moments of silence, but it's fine, isn't it because you're walking and you're walking, you're taking in what's around you, you're thinking about what you're going to say or you're thinking about how you're going to respond to what they've said. And it just removes that kind of awkwardness in the situation. So I've been a real advocate for walking meetings. And I've seen them quite a lot of published studies now to that emphasise the benefits of taking a walk and talking. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
And it's not just me saying just a work capacity, right, you say whether it's with your partner, or what I've talked about on our parent workshops that we've been delivering for parents that have been struggling during the lockdown in particular, is that they might be quarantined with a teenager and there might have been worrying about how they feel but it's quite intimidating to sit a teenager down and a bit intrusive really to question them and ask them how they're feeling. Whereas if they just go for a walk, it's a more lighthearted way of just just casually saying, How are you and Tiffany Yeah, nation rather than just directly asking them because they've already shown On the walk and like you said that the end point that you'll get into So, yeah, it doesn't seem as so. 
 
Mike O’Hara 
Yeah, I think from thinking about it now actually thinking from even like a sort of, I like to think about how we as humans have evolved from the caveman. And I think about that when I talk about stress and fight and flight response. And I think this could be built into that as well in the sense that you feel like maybe there's an escape or out when you're kind of out walking and you're in the open, you don't feel as confined you don't feel as backed into a corner. So it is something quite sensitive as well, you're going to talk about, or maybe you're quite apprehensive about talking to a child and they might be feeling apprehensive about you sort of putting on the spot about something that they might be uncomfortable around, then at least you both feel like there's that kind of emergency exit if you like, you don't feel trapped in that scenario. So I think that's probably a positive benefit as well. It's just something to put you both She's 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
definitely, and I'm just thinking about that as well. And we always have. I don't know if you've noticed, Mike, we always have a lot of important conversations when we walk in together. 
 
Mike O’Hara 
Which ones of those? 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
Well, I'm just gonna ask you now, are you walking? What do you think about the house we viewed today?
 
Mike O’Hara 
I think that's the I think the zoom connections are breaking out. Okay. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
I know I just mean, sometimes when we sat in the house, we don't. We don't talk to each other. You know, the tallies are and you look at your phone, whereas if we're outsize, there's nothing else for not nothing else to do. But you're kind of it pulls together a little bit and we and we talk about things that are on our mind. 
 
Mike O’Hara 
And there's nothing pulling you away from them that is there. And while it's fine to have that, you're more comfortable with that silence and there's the the nature we're lucky where we live to take in or the abuse See the nature and at the same time, something that we know we both like to do is to leave if we can, and it's safe to do so. We like to leave our phones at home, don't worry, because the temptation is buzzes in your pocket or you've got an email that you're waiting on, or all your mates are chatting in the group message and you want to keep up with what's going on. Yeah, that one time that you've made to potentially spend together if it's a loved one or something like that, or even if it's just on your own, and you've decided, right, I'm going to go out for a walk, clear my head, the last thing you want is to be sort of bound to your device, which, unfortunately, increasingly, I think we all are. So yeah, I think it's a really good idea, as I say if it's safe to do so, to leave devices at home, or at least to zip them in our back pocket or something like that for emergencies. because it forces you to be mindful and mindful. And it's just something we talk about a lot. We hear about it a lot. We're probably associated with things like meditation actually sitting down Doing a formal meditation practice. But mindfulness essentially is just bringing our attention back to the here and now and we haven't got phones to distract. And we're just walking and taking in everything we can see in here then. It's a kind of shortcut to mindfulness without perhaps the the skill required for something like meditation. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
And we've never missed anything when we get back and we look at our phones. Oh, no, it's been an hour What's happened? Nothing. It's, it's ridiculous that we feel like we have to keep checking so often, in a way. 
 
Mike O’Hara 
Yeah, definitely. It definitely kind of puts us in a position where we can't do that. And sometimes, that sort of back kick to put the phone down and go outside is what we need. And I think that it's been really uplifting for me to realise that the power of walking for my mental health I'm really glad that I found something that I know will help me feel better because I think when we do feel anxious, and we do feel overwhelmed by stress, then part of the panic that we feel is not knowing how to make ourselves feel better how to find a way out of that situation. And it's nice when you do find a coping strategy that really works for you. And that's why obviously, you and I are both so passionate about walking. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
Yeah, yeah. So actually, I've got a couple of coping strategies that you can use whilst on a walk. But first of all, where are you right now? I can hear lots of birdsong. 
 
Mike O’Hara 
Okay, so I'm down by the river at the moment. So when we come out of the house, that takes you through some, some houses and then you kind of emerge onto my riverbank, which is really nice. It's actually my favourite part of the walk. And that's where you get all the all the geese and the ducks and rabbits running around. And they've all just had little ones who got ducklings and goslings. It's really nice. And the sun's just coming down. So yeah, it's a really nice time and I so that's where I am just alongside the river, 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
Are the little goslings there? and now can you see them 
 
Mike O’Hara 
I can see them in the distance. Yeah, I'm like, no, not. Unfortunately, I'm not close enough to do that. But I can see them all sort of settling down for the evening. So, 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
yeah, it's nice. Yeah, because I'm obsessed at the moment I walked along with their account in the goal each day to check that they're all still safe. They're all still there. But it's been really nice because we've kind of gone not Samer every day. But you know, we've kind of tied to that river banking because it's our favourite spot into our walls each day. And then you get to notice things that you wouldn't normally notice when you're really busy or you don't go for a walk and just watching the growth of the Gosling's and adult claims has been really cute. I've really enjoyed it. And it's just those little things that you don't even think about normally and bringing it back to the basics and it's been, it's been lovely. 
 
Mike O’Hara 
It gives you perspective as well which is massive for mental health and well being and sometimes it can be the hardest thing to employ. I think it's easy to say so to somebody to say to yourself, okay, you need to have some perspective and look at the positives in life. But you know, they're empty words, a lot of the time that you can actually get out and see things that make you sort of feel right in your gut or in your heart that you know, it's impossible not to feel good when you see some newborn ducklings swimming along the river with the sun behind them, I would challenge anyone to, to not think that that was a nice image. So yeah, gives you a bit of perspective as well. I think sometimes. The simplicity of it is really powerful. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
Yeah. So back to the coping strategy, then. The first one that I've got is called a 54321 challenge. And it's, well, you can do anywhere it's meant to help you in the moment, if you're suffering with anxiety, and it's just a simple way to control your mind. Get that well get that control back basically when I'm sorry. He's trying to take over. And so some people count backwards, but this one's a bit different. This one is about what you can see and hear. So, if you just want to do with me and tell me, okay, it'll make sense. We'll talk you through it. So, first of all, then you need to name five things that you can say. 
 
Mike O’Hara 
Okay, that's relatively easy. Well, the first one is there's a guy doing press ups one side of the river so he's obviously ignored. He hasn't got the memo about just going for a nice gentle walk and he's going for a bit more but fairplay to that. So he's going through it is on two squats now But yeah, I can see him. I can see the sun coming down see the sun setting which is nice. I can see Blackbird foraging around in the bush. I can see the river and I can see all the ducks and their little ducklings. So quite nice quite lucky. You've asked me to do this at this point. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
Yeah, nice, nice thing. Okay, so you've got a bit windy there. Okay, well that's better. And so, four things that you can feel or four things that you can touch. 
 
Mike O’Hara 
Okay, so I can feel the grass in between my toes because I've got my flip flops on. I can feel there's a slight breeze which might be up to here. I can feel that and I can feel fat as I said, that said that dragged my foot through this also, I felt that and I can feel that the phone in my hand, my fingertips. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
Okay, good. So now we want to three things that you can hear. 
 
Mike O’Hara 
Okay, well, I don't know if you can hear them. But there's a whole host of blackbirds on the grass next to me who will crow in so they're the main thing I can hear. I can hear the sound of my voice. I don't know if it's cheating. And I can also hear just very very faintly in the distance the kind of rumble of some traffic or and I think I've just heard it sounded like a gunshot hope it's not what it was. That's for 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
Yeah, thanks again. Shut one. I think you might 
 
Mike O’Hara 
have been one of those things that scares the birds. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
Okay, so what was that three things you can hear? Okay, two things that you can smell 
 
Mike O’Hara 
I can smell I can smell the grass has recently been cut so I'm still getting the remnants of that so I can smell fresh cut grass now. Yeah, it's not quite as strong as I'd like but I can still I can still get the width of it. And I can also smell some other kind of plants flower that's down by the riverside but I'm not an expert on flowers and plants so I wouldn't have to tell you exactly what it was but it's something floral. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
It's just it's me walking down there. So the spring blossom at the moment. Isn't it and it's so fragrant. Sweet and just breathing it in those birds Really? Go for it. 
 
Mike O’Hara 
That's probably about 100 on the fair. Next we have just emerged onto like a rugby pitch. There's probably 100 black birds on it. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
Sure they're not crows. They sound pretty. 
 
Mike O’Hara 
Oh yeah, sorry. Yeah, sorry, the crows. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
Right. So five things that you can see four things that you can touch three things you can hear two things you can smell. Now, one thing that you can taste, 
 
Mike O’Hara 
that's easy. So not long before my walk, I had a nice big roast dinner. So I can still taste the gravy and mustard and all that. It's a nice, it's a nice, nice, but that's what I can taste. I can taste my roast dinner. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
So I guess the idea of that is it's getting you to think about what's around you. So not only is it Getting into be a bit more mindful of what's around you and a bit more in the moment. But it's also going through that process is helping you take your mind off of the things. I don't know if you found that it was like a little, a little. Yeah. Why something that you needed to think about? And do and did it take your mind off? 
 
Mike O’Hara 
Yeah, definitely there was an element of having to think about it, and me concentrating on that one thing. But I'd also say that even though we did it in quite sort of staged way, and I wasn't in a kind of state of anxiety or anything like that, when we did it, the one thing that I had been a little bit sort of uneasy about or felt a little bit self conscious about was the fact that I'm kind of walking along. Seemingly talking to myself, even though I've got the headphones in, I never quite get comfortable with the kind of concept of walking along and talking to that phone to my ear. And I've been worrying about people sort of looking at me and thinking, Oh, god, there's that bloke walking along the river talking to himself. So in the time that we were doing the 54321 actually stopped thinking about that. Wasn't worrying about that. So while I was just concentrating on what you're asking me to do, so I think that kind of shows that it works, it takes your mind off what might be troubling you and focuses you on the here and now and what you can see smell, hear, taste and taste. I'm not sure if I got them in the right order 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
enough. So it's about being self conscious, because I used to be quite embarrassed to admit that I'd go for a walk on my own. 
 
Mike O’Hara 
Okay. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
Well, when people used to say to me, oh, what did you do last night? And they don't be like, Oh, I went to the pub or so my, you know, played a game like PlayStation, techie people, all those kind of things and, and I said, I'll go for a walk. I think they all thought I was a little bit silly. 
 
Mike O’Hara 
We're not we're not really a TV, people our home. A lot of people think we're a bit stranger instead of staying in and watching the latest series of whatever it might be on. NET We say, Oh, we just went for a walk. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
Yeah. And that's exactly how I felt they'd all be watching all these different things on Netflix. They're like, Oh, man. So today I'm on episode nine. And like, yeah, went for a walk. And I think it's because there's no, there's not always an end goal is there to a war. There's always a point. 
 
Mike O’Hara 
I think we think of it now, unfortunately, it's sort of society as well. I think increasingly, we, we always seek to see what we can get out of something. And we're also quite interested in consuming all the time. And you know, it's what can What can I get from this? What's the latest thing I can buy? What's the latest thing I can watch? Everything has to be kind of tangible. So we can put it on social media, and it has to kind of be an end result in everything. And I think, you know, you and I probably both guilty of that as well. We like to feel like achieve something and perhaps just go for a walk because we think of it's such a functional thing. Just to get from A to B. We don't think of it as something that can be done for pleasure, I suppose. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
And, and also a shame to admit this, but I went for a walk one time on my own and I was walking through a field and I see some people in the distance. And my first thought was, oh my god, they're gonna see me walking by myself. Which now now I've accepted how much I love walking and that it's absolutely fine. It seems ridiculous, but at that time, I was really embarrassed by it. And, and I could see that they were walking a dog, but I couldn't see the dog. They're so far away. The only reason that I knew they were walking a dog was because they had their arm out, but rather for the lead. And, and this is so embarrassing, but I put my arm out. I pretended I was gonna dog just because I would. It's ridiculous, isn't it? I'd rather do that than pretend that Well, I'd rather pretend to be walking a dog with my arm out then. Just go for a walk on my own. What would you What would you have done if they stopped to talk to you and the dog never came? But 
 
Mike O’Hara 
I think you've had to pretend you've lost it 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
really far in the distance. 
 
Mike O’Hara 
No, but I can understand your point. And also, it made me think, have you ever because I've certainly been in this position, being walking somewhere, maybe through town or something like that. And, or you're walking late at night or something, I don't know. But then you pull your phone out. Because you feel like you're sort of walking somewhere on your own or you feel slightly anxious, or, I don't know, how many people do you see? Who can't bear to just walk with their head? I mean, it might be that thing if you don't want to make eye contact with someone like I, I'm a bit of a country boy, as we've covered in the previous podcast or the one before. And I find that when I walk through London, I feel like everyone gives me funny looks because I my heads up and I'm kind of looking people in the faces. I can pass them not. I don't think in a weird way. I'm not trying to say hello to them or smiling, particularly, but everybody just has their head down on their phone because I think Do I think partly it's the connection we have to our devices these days that we've talked about previously. And I think we will, it can be a really good thing, but also can sort of damage mental health as well. But also, I think it's that insecurity that you feel, what's the first thing you do when you sit down on the tube? If there's somebody opposite you, you pull your phone out, and you look down at your phone, because then you feel that comfort blanket, then you feel that sense of security. So I think you're certainly not alone and feeling a little self conscious when you're just out for a wonder. Yeah, definitely. Yeah. But once you kind of, I think it's really liberating once you realise that, okay, I'm doing this because it makes me feel better. And you wouldn't feel that way. If you're out for a run necessarily, would you if you went through a game of tennis, so I think you can see it the same way. It's, yeah, it's a really sort of nice feeling. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
Yeah. And where are you now then? 
 
Mike O’Hara 
So I'm just approaching bridge so kind of coming around. I've gone past the rugby pitch. I'm just coming around, there's a running track, there's a lot of people are exercising their dogs is really nice Dalmatian running around and I'm half opening up to me. Doesn't seem too interested at the minute. But yeah, there's a lot of nice, happy people around them some nice happy dogs running around as well. So it's actually really nice. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
Okay, so I've got another coping strategy for anxiety, which again, doesn't have to be done when you're outdoors. But I always think it's a nice one to do, because it connects to that mindfulness. So it's about breathing. And I always think that when you want to walk, it's really nice to take a big deep breath of fresh air. So the last one, the last one was called the 54321 method. This one's called the 478. So lots of numbers. 
 
Mike O’Hara 
Okay. So me with my mask, okay, I'll talk 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
you through it. So this one is particularly good even helps people Go to sleep, it's good. If you're struggling to get to sleep, it's meant to be a trick for that. And it's also focusing on counting and focusing on your breathing. So all you do is breathe in for four counts. Hold your breath for seven counts, and then breathe out slowly for eight counts. So you want to do it and I'll 
 
Mike O’Hara 
never be particularly entertaining for our listeners, but 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
they can do it with us. Okay, yeah. Okay, yeah. So breathe in for four counts. Hold for seven. And breathe out for eight counts. Okay. Yeah, 
 
Mike O’Hara 
I'm gonna do it again. Yeah, give it up. Yeah, it's quite nice. Actually. I was getting this whatever. That's floral, smelly switch. Exactly. Sure. What's. what it is. I'm getting a lot of fat. Want to take a deep breath. Same which is nice. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
Yeah. So can you breathe in for four? Hold it for seven and then let go over eight counts. Okay. Yeah. Good. So how do you feel? Yeah, 
 
Mike O’Hara 
I feel good. Yeah, and I'm genuinely not just saying that either. I feel like with me I hold a lot of tension in my stomach. I find that that's one of the areas that now I know if I'm feeling anxious sometimes my stomach tells me that I'm feeling anxious because it's sort of knots up and stuff and I felt them when I let that let out for eight there. I just felt everything relaxing. Yeah. felt a bit of kind of even just the tension of you know, when you're walking, you're kind of tense a little bit down. You just felt that kindness. 
 
Unknown 
foldaway? Yeah, 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
dude. Yes, sir. You've just crossed the bridge. I think I know where you are. And I think you're not far away from home. So before you do get back, what's your favourite thing about walking? And then? 
 
Mike O’Hara 
Well, there's several things, but I guess for me is your most, you're almost forced to take that break. I think. Especially, like we said earlier, if you can put the phone away or even just go alone, sometimes, you know, we're all locked down at the minute. We're all stuck indoors. same place, same people all the time. As much as we love our family. Sometimes you need that break. And I just feel like it's that kind of enforced. Mindfulness if you like it doesn't sound particularly nice, but it can be really hard just to stop sometimes Can't you just feel like every day is a million miles an hour, there's always something to do. And I think that with a walk. Sometimes you set out on a walk and you don't even know where you're going to end up. But that's nice. It's nice to just have that enforced kind of break. You can relax you can think things through and then like I said before, I've never returned from a walk, feeling more stressed out than when I started unless the dog runs off. That's the only exception. So yeah, it's a kind of enforced break that it gives you. It's nice. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
Yeah. How about you? And mine. Mine is probably nature like we've talked about the ducks and the rabbits and everything that we see all the birds and and I just love noticing that and listening to it. It's been really nice listening to you, but hearing all the birds in the background, it's really it's really nice. It sounds like a lovely man. And even when I lived in a city centre, I could still go to a park and get get that access to nature and still have those smells of fresh grass and like the still trees around the store ways of getting that button And even if there isn't, I remember when I scraped for a walk in any in the winter when it gets dark, and I used to feel safer walking around streets rather than, you know, fields and things, and I'm letting all my secrets out in this podcast, but let me just say this mic, but I used to really enjoy, you know, just about 6pm. And everyone gets home from work or school or wherever they are and everyone's lights are on but they haven't been on because yeah, you can see in people's houses. Okay. 
 
Mike O’Hara 
as a as a trained sort of mental health advocate, I'm not sure that I'm going to recommend that we stock on a bus 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
now. Let's see where I'm going with it. So it wasn't just to spy on the neighbours, but sometimes you'd go past and you'd see families through a window sitting down for dinner. Or maybe someone chopping their vegetables or that window. It's just like little things that I'd notice and it was actually quite comforting comforting that people around and the families around and everyone's in their little houses and their little bubbles have been just just those simple things really I used to really like just walking around and seeing what everyone was 
 
Mike O’Hara 
taking it all in, isn't it it's just taking things in because again, what do we always do we always put our head down and we're trying to get somewhere so we striding along the pavement head down looking at our feet or we've got the phone now or Yeah, we're texting somebody or on the phone or whatever it might be. It's really just stuff in taking what's around us doing and that's my favourite thing about our walk I think even if it is a bit creepy to look to people's windows 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
or not, but So I do enjoy it. And so I think you're probably newly home. And that's probably 20 minutes when you walk in there, which is the daily recommended Mau, isn't it? 
 
Mike O’Hara 
Oh, yeah. Is it? I didn't know that. But I would certainly recommend at least 20 minutes. Yeah, if he can do more. And also, you know, he can't manage that much. It's just about building what you can into your routine. And I'll always emphasise how important routine is mental health. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
So, let's encourage everyone to go out and take a walk or listen to us and take a walk with us. 
 
Mike O’Hara 
Yeah, definitely. Yeah. Really good idea. Actually. Stick the earphones in and listen to you and I ramble on for 20 minutes. I was a walking joke. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
Yeah, yeah. Got it. 
 
Mike O’Hara 
Yep. Thank you, everybody. 
 
Abbey O'Hara 
Bye bye. 
 
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